Ease UP!!... Lets get back to the POINT >>> GST
puck at holycow.com
Thu Nov 16 21:31:37 EST 2000
> Ok thats enough, I tired to be nice, but you're the one who's a broken
> record here. I have heard the following words so many times "Phoenix is
> broken." It may be right, so WHAT.
Hey, all I'm doing is explaining myself to those telling me to ease up.
Part of that explanation requires me to point out just how wrong you are.
If they'd stop telling me to ease up, I'll stop posting on the subject. :)
> I was trying to be nice in a few
> emails, tried to start some strategy discussion. Joe, we need to have a
> talk, I dont want to be your enemy, but if thats what its going
> to come down to so be it.
I don't know about 'enemy' (though you're a Phoenix and an Agasha, so IC
you *are*) but if you're going to keep saying that Phoenix isn't too strong,
I'm going to keep making fun of you and such statements (until it somehow
> Look, I never said you have to agree with my view or believe
> what I say. The point is I have an opinion, however wrong that may be I
> have a right to say it, and you have a right to state yours. This is a
> discussion, not an agruement can we keep it that way.
There's enough hard evidence out there that Phoenix's strength is not an
opinion, but a solid fact. The proof is in the numbers from the past year,
and the fact that there has been no card or set of cards that will change
You can't say "The sky is made of blue cheese." and then justify something
that's completely incorrect by saying "Hey, it's just my opinion."
What you can do, is try to bring up evidence or logical deduction that
proves your point, like:
1. Phoenix isn't strong, it's just that there's a lot of us, so the numbers
are skewed for our wins.
(This isn't true, though the Phoenix says it is -- numbers from the GSTs,
RSTs and GenCon show that Phoenix is represented as a "middle of the pack"
2. Phoenix isn't strong, it's just that the best players all play Phoenix.
(This also isn't true. If it were, Phoenix would have done much better
prior to their initial broken card granting. Now I'm not saying Phoenix
players suck or anything, but they're no better or worse than the members of
any other clan.)
What you *did* do was just say "I don't think Phoenix is all that strong
any more. They just don't have the strength they used to." Nothing to back
it up, just some general comment that you *think* is right. And then we
proved you wrong, over and over again. Here I am doing it *again*, and your
only rebuttal is "I don't think they're very strong any more" or "You can
beat them, just build your deck like this."
(BTW, my rebuttal to the "you can beat them if you build your deck this
way" is thusly: People have known this for the past year or longer, and
*have done*, and it hasn't helped. I mentioned it in my initial posting,
thanks for noticing. Phoenix is *the threat*, people know that, people
prepare for it, and Phoenix still wins. You're *that strong*.)
To sum up this post, Phoenix "strong or not" is *not* an opinion. It can
be quantitatively measured (and has been) as to just how strong Phoenix is.
And the answer is "Way too strong."
Joe Fulgham | Hitomi Pukku | puck at holycow.com
Dragon Clan Shugenja * Master of the Web * Dragon in Black
Secret Master of L5R | http://www.holycow.com/l5r/
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